If you provide some actually useful info regarding your needs and criteria, you may get some input. As it is, we don't know how much you want to spend, how many miles you cover, the type of journeys being done, the amount of space required (d you actually need a 7 seater?). Without this, it is difficult to make any meaningful comments.

Going back to your first point about buying a car and running it till it dies, this suggests reliability is the most important point. With that info, and assuming you actually need a 7 seater, the obvious choices would be the Toyota Verso or Mazda 5, both with petrol engines.

If you're looking at a car 5 to 7 years old, a diesel won't have lower running costs unless you're very lucky: expensive repairs will cancel out the advantage of better mpg.

Thanks for the reply , would it be possible for quick what's what as to the reason a diesel would be more expensive than a petrol ,it's something I can't get my head around . In my experience of the two I've preferred the diesel in its characteristics as well as the running costs.

Edited by SLO76 on 25/08/2019 at 10:32

Ive just googled "who makes the diesel engine for the zafira tourer" not much info cones back as to who makes it. , Where can I find out more info

Thanks for the help. Having had some questions answered here and seen a few mixed used car reviews it seems really 50 / 50 with regards to reliability so although not completely ruled out I've started to look at other options as well trying to keep an open mind but my gut is not so comfortable with the zafira . So I'll keep looking.

One reason I considered the zaf was I had a model a at one point and although I was never a fan of the car I must admit I was quite reliable then moved to a petrol picasso with less guts about it and lower mpg hence the idea of going back to a diesel zaf with better mpg but not sure now. But I'll keep looking .

Any more help and ideas would still be greatly appreciated

As little as possible but 6 to 9

Thanks for those suggestions , I'll look into them a little more. I still struggle with the concept of the diesels costing more ,it's just something I can't get my head around.. the two diesels I've had in the past ran fine till the car became financially stupid to keep pumping money into. I suppose that maybe down to the fact they where older ( less complicated ) engines compared to today's engines and as such I've not experienced the problems new diesels can have. I had been looking forward to the fuel economy and the savings in theory that would being every year.

I will look into the above cars but another car that's cropped up is the ford grand cmax ,it seems to get decent used reviews.

As for price £6k would always be the better option but £9k is fine for the right car.

I suppose I just need more research time to look around. Also where on earth do you find info on who makes what engine. I've googled but to avail at least on the first few Google pages.

Again thanks for all the help

Just the concept of its a GM car so expect problems is making it a difficult choice.

While the Carens makes financial sense, the 1.6 petrol is gutless and not nice to drive, it will soon frustrate you. The diesel is better but still not a nice to drive as the Zafira Tourer. The beauty of the Zafira Tourer is due to there wide availability you can afford to be fussy and find a good one that’s been looked after. Again it’s a GM car so expect problems but value for money wise it’s one of the best on the market.

I didn't suggest the petrol Carens. And while the diesel Zafira Tourer may well be nicer to drive, the fact that the OP keeps his cars till they die, means that (IMO anyway), the reliablity aspect should come first and foremost. And yes, the diesel Zafira Tourer is also faster and more powerful than the diesel Carens, but it isn't going to be a noticeable margin unless you are flat out all the time and certainly wouldn't feel underpowered (the 165bhp Zaf makes 258lb/ft of torque @1750rpm, the 134bhp Carens makes 243lb/ft @1750rpm).

The Toyota Verso is a different kettle of fish though, as while you did get them with the 1.8 engine, they will be a bit older, the youngest ones hitting the bottom of the OP's budget range will be 1.6. And with 118lb/ft of torque @ 4400rpm that probably would be hard work.

So with that in mind, out of (my) 2 petrol suggestions, i'd probably be inclined towards the Mazda 5 2.0.

If sticking with petrol, there is also the possibility of a VW Touran with the 1.4TSI engine, which, in theory, would be the best of both worlds. But in practice, there are very few about, and most are >2011. I don't know the date that they changed this engine from chain to belt, but i do know that the chain drive models had a reputation, so i'd be looking carefully to ensure any potential candidate was belt drive.

Edited by SLO76 on 26/08/2019 at 20:48

Thanks for all the help.

My mileage is between 9 - 11 k a year , so serviced every year

Looking at autotrader for specs like boot size in litres etc as well as tax and real mpg on honest John a zafira diesel would be about £250 cheaper a year than the 1.4 and in my experience ( with older diesels ) I struggle to see what would cost the equivalent of £250 on a diesel a year on average . How ever I do keep hearing about this more expensive thing from different sources which makes me think there's no smoke without fire. But still a struggle.

SLO , you make an unhappy yet compelling argument.

In your opinion if zaf go 1.4 petrol.

Or petrol on cmax. But not 1.5 diesel. . still similar issues ????

Thanks for that .

1.5 diesel ford or 1.4 petrol zaf.????

Also what is considered a longerdistance, and I presume that's more to do with the dpf

We tend to do stop start town driving in the week but most weekends there's a round trip of at least 20 miles at various speed limits mostly 50 ton70

I think the cmax boot maybe to small for what we want ,hence the zaf or grand cmax etc. .

To be honest what I would like not don't have the money is a nice grand tourneo connect .

But I will continue to look around and ask questions

What's the more reliable engine the ford 1.6 lower hp or the 147hp 1.6 ecoboost