659FBE
You rightly complain about the diabolical Passat/A4 front suspension design - the work of a madman, surely!
I also thought it very poor of VW to use aluminium alloy sealing washers on the brake calipers. These are subject to electrolytic corrosion and quite a few owners have lost all their brake fluid. I'm surprised this was not the subject of a recall. Why on Earth VAG used this most unsuitable material is baffling.
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My Dad had an L reg Passat new in 1994 or whenever, it was utter junk. It went rusty in two years, had rattles in the interior, and engine hesitation problems, and was totally lack lustre.
Our family deemed never to own another VW.
Last year I broke the rule, and I'm paying the price. They are still a triumph of marketing over engineering. The dealerships are dismal too.
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Ooh good, a VW bashing thread. Haven't had one of these for at least a week!
No significant problems with my Polo
No problems with my current Golf
No problems with either of the Passats my other half has had, or the two Golfs and a Polo he had before that.
Are we going to have to have a horror stories thread for every car brand or are people going to accept that cars do go wrong, and customer service varies depending on the people working in the dealership and not the brand?
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customer service varies depending on the people working in the dealership and not the brand?
Unless we're talking about VW UK's customer 'service' which is the worst I've ever experienced from any marque and of course that isn't dependent on individual dealerships.
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VW (UK) customer service IS very poor IME. I have written previously about a 1-month wait for a Sharan (taxi) gearbox mainshaft. I didn't get it until I personally rang Germany and sorted it out with them.
For my own motoring I really prefer cars that are well-sorted and have been debugged by the manufacturer, especially the electronics - hence my preference for most things Japanese.
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>>Are we going to have to have a horror stories thread for every car brand or are people going to accept that cars do go wrong>>
I agree PG hence I said above "This is rather a half glass empty type of thread, in general IMO it is better to share good experiences unless someone is in the market for a particular model and wants to know what to look out for."
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Read the reader reviews about the ultra reliable Honda Accord for example.
www.whatcar.com/car-review-readers.aspx?MA=14&RT=4...O
{please do not post direct links to 'What Car' , ie, leave off the http part of the link - DD}
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Interesting that in What Car, the Mondeo in their number one new and number one used family car beating Accord, Avensis, Passat etc in both counts.
However with regard to the comments about the Accord, as with this thread and numerous ones in tech it is problems that get reported, not many people make the point of reporting good news.
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Unless we're talking about VW UK's customer 'service' which is the worst I've ever experienced from any marque and of course that isn't dependent on individual dealerships.
Citroen customer service consists of "go and ask the local dealer". Problem was I suspected the local dealer was playing fast and loose over an earlier job they had failed to carry out correctly and were under playing the potential consequences - issue was timing belt slip on an Hdi engine.
Cit UK response was to tell me to go ask another dealer!!
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"Citroen customer service consists of "go and ask the local dealer"".
Sorry to be blunt, but it will do. Your contract as a purchaser is with the dealer. The dealer takes the profit out of the vehicle. The dealer has trained staff (yes, I know.... it wouldn't seem so sometimes!) to look after the vehicle. If the car has a fault that the dealer don't get, they will liaise with a technical department at the factory, who deal directly with the dealer and aren't customer facing, so the dealer liaise with the customer when they obtain an answer. For the most part, a manufacturer's customer service team is there as someone to take the emotion out of it and help solve the issue in liaison with technical depts, parts etc. etc. etc. Manufacturers are not a parent and the dealers their errant children. They are, for the most part, franchises who are their own separate businesses. Manufacturers can influence, but not dictate. Of course, ultimately, if a dealer consistently fouls up, he will lose the franchise.
Also, re some other threads... I know of several "bloke down the pub" types who have had what they term issues with luxury marques. All I am saying is if something is to manufacturer's specification and is proven by an independent examination to be that way, and the "fault" suffered is, let's say, due to battery technology lagging behind car technology, then IT IS NOT a "fault" of the car. You can inform the press, Jeremy Clarkson, the Pope and anyone you want. Oh and just for everyone's info, if you buy something accepting the technology contained therein, you cannot bleat "not fit for purpose" 6 months later. Not fit for purpose is, legally, an entirely different thing!
Therapy is a wonderful thing.
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No problems with my current Golf
>
Well, apart from the paint, you mean? IIRC you were pretty critical of the dealer.
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>>Are we going to have to have a horror stories thread for every car brand or are people going to accept that cars do go wrong, and customer service varies depending on the people working in the dealership and not the brand? <<
I think VW open themselves up for the criticism by making absurd claims about high quality cars and charging prices to match. When people then buy them they are then sadly let down.
I think people expect cars to go wrong some time (although that still baffles me in this day and age) but with VW the customer is then subsequently let down by the dealer and VW customer service team.
I also think you are wrong about the variable service - it is down to the manufacturer to fix this just like Toyota, Lexus, & Honda have done.
I appreciate VW are easy prey on this site but isn't that their fault and where are the rules that say we can only mention it once. Why have a site like this ?
Is VW service like the war -I mentioned it once and think I got away with it.
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I bought a 3 year old 1998 (premium branded) A4 TDI with Audi warranty.
Just as well it had a warranty
New catalyst, 2 new front wishbones, air conditioning condenser and timing belt + tenioner (despite being replaced before I bought it) in 2 years. And a new battery.
Made my prior Rover 800 look reliable.
POC. Never bought an Audi since.
madf
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I'm sorry, but I find the whole basis of this thread rather distasteful, and IMO not something this forum should be encouraging.
Fine if Mazman has a poor VW experience he wishes to share, and then perhaps to open up a wider and objective discussion on VW build quality.
However, his basis for opening the discussion was gratuitous VW bashing which surely is not in the best interests of this excellent forum. I notice that he has not contributed to the 'debate' and that over 40 respondents have rushed in to furnish the topic with passing semblance of credibility. FTR, I have no personal experience of VW, but I would find any thread on any marque started in this way a poor use of this forum.
If HJ can ban turgid discussions on Top Gear, then surely someone with an editor's key should have something to say about this....!?
Splodgeface
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SF,
Yes watched the development of this thread, the OP sets out his stall and is then discussed. I don't know what his point is seeing as in an earlier post he's talking about buying either an Ibeza or a Golf..
HJ himself hasn't commented and there seems to be no breach of the Forum's policies. Threads are remarkably self-editing with a balance of views being given on topics, this one being no exception and a lively discussion then ensuing and the Mods stepping in when there are breaches of etiquette and policies. Maybe the OP owns a Laguna - who knows.
HJ will offer his view no doubt soon. Be patient.
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One thing I have noticed with VW owners, is that many are so far up their own backsides, they don't even notice the continual knocking inside the dashboard etc...
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>>However, his basis for opening the discussion was gratuitous VW bashing which surely is not in the best interests of this excellent forum<<
I find it quite interesting as I have many VW customers but havent owned one for 10 years myself.
The forum is excellent because it is broad and denying people the opportunity to share their experiences, which judging by the responses are both GOOD and BAD therefore balanced, is just an attempt to direct the forum in an individuals own direction - I dont much care for half the threads and if I read the OP and have no interest, I dont read on - what I dont do is get my knickers in a knot about the validity of it. Given the level of response, many users DO want to say their piece so let them and read something else.
VW, along with many other car makers, is open to bashing because on occasion they fail to meet expectation - when they improve im quite sure it will stop - when did you last see a Subaru bashing thread?
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VW "bashing" is becoming an art form in these forums....
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>>I'm sorry, but I find the whole basis of this thread rather distasteful, >>
I tend to agree (though distasetful is perhaps a bit strong) and have said so a couple of times above.
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One point that seems to have been missed is that Skoda owners not only love their cars, but 90 per cent would recommend to a friend to buy one according to one big annual survey (Skoda finished third overall IIRC).
In fact Skoda are normally in the top three.
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Skoda out score VW and Audi because the customers expectations are lower so more easily met.
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I'm not sure that that is correct. Certainly the taxi drivers in my area (probably 80 per cent) use Skoda Octavia in both hatchback and estate form (plus the odd Superb) and can't praise them enough.
As taxi use is probably the hardest use any vehicle can be put to, plus the need for reliability to keep earning their keep, that's seems highly supportive.
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Skoda out score VW and Audi because the customers expectations are lower so more easily met.
I don't agree, in fact you might argue that people looking for value may expect more- at least in terms of reliabaility/effecient service if not in fancy glass buildings and filter coffee........
Actually there are a few good reasons why Skoda do better- their factories are more modern for a start having been subject of massive investment in infrastructure. Secondly Skoda dealers tend to be family operations who've built up a customer base and intend to keep it rather than some corporate money making machine like most 'don't give a fig' VW dealers who know some other mug is just around the corner.
Please note my comments about VW customer service apply to the useless UK arm only. VW Germany give quite excellent service as do the knowledgeable dealers I've used.
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>> Skoda out score VW and Audi because the customers expectations are lower so more easily met. I don't agree in fact you might argue that people looking for value may expect more- at least in terms of reliabaility/effecient service if not in fancy glass buildings and filter coffee........
I agree with your other points however the expactations pioint is a fact and managing expecations is key in CS these days.
Put it another way, a Skoda driver who trades it for an Audi will be dispointed if the car is no better to drive, is no more reliable and the service is no better, he/she will expect to receive more for the additional cost and will be disatisfied if his/her expectations are not met.
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