"If driving above the speed limit then yes"
Whats the speed limit in fog, rain or snow?...
Still 70mph...
Which is plain daft!
I agree with the general concensus - if you are driving inapropriately for the conditions, too close or too fast then you should be done...
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Statistically, vehicle per mile, motorways are the safest roads you can drive on. But they lull stupid or tired car drivers into a false sense of security. Even if you are driving at a boring 60 or 70mph, you can still keep yourself awake by observation. Look ahead. Look behind. Anticipate what everyone else on the road will do. Plan ahead like a game of chess. Then you won't hit anything and are highly unlikely to be hit by anything else. Even if traffic is backed up and you are the last car, brake slowly so your brake lights stay on, leave plenty of space in front of you, keep your brake lights lit, keep watching your mirrors, put your hazards on, and if the driver behind isn't stopping you can move into the space you've left in front of you.
HJ
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Spot on HJ - and how satisfying it is when the zombies ahead are panic braking and you already have the situation in hand, a large gap in front of you and enough time to keep an eye on what's behind.
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Quite HJ. There is almost no situation where driving into another vehicle whether moving or at rest is not your own fault in some way. On a motorway especially. Even if someone makes an unexpected move you should have left yourself enough space to avoid them. The only instance I can think of where you have no choices is if a vehicle travelling in the opposite direction smashes through the central resevation suddenly and violently.
At the risk of pomposity I have driven over a million miles in my life so far and while I have witnessed the results of many motorway accidents I have so far, been fortunate enough not to have been a participant in any. It's just a case of being aware of your own limitations, those of your vehicle, an awareness of weather and traffic conditions and driving accordingly.
Also a a healthy cynicism of the abilities of others helps a bit too......
;-)
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HJ is absolutely right. I got taught all of this on a motorway driving lesson. Some of the tips I still follow:
1. Remember what cars are behind/around and when you don't know where they went (e.g. lapse of concentration) then be very wary until you've figured out where they went (e.g. blind spot).
2. Never drive with a vehicle to the left and right because you have no escape route. If in this situation briefly accelerate/slow to make a gap.
3. Always leave a decent gap in front and therefore break earlier but less aggressively than those in front.
4. If someone is too close behind, then ease of the accelerator to slow you and them down - but never jab the brakes aggressively.
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if I have someone tailgating me, what I do is flash the brakelights, whist accelerating, that normally gives me a gap - then I will drop a lane if possible, allow the idiot to overtake safely, then carry on as normal.
this I don't do aggressively, as it could wind the tailgater up, which could cause more grief!
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I noticed this para in the telegraph over the weekend, about driving in France:
'But you can also be fined heavily and banned for several years for "failure to maintain a safe distance", specifically 130 metres (142 yards) when travelling at 130kph.'
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>>"failure to maintain a safe distance" specifically 130 metres (142 yards) when travelling at 130kph.'
3.6 second gap.
Makes sense to me... but try that round here, and some knob will invariably see the space, and change lanes into it!
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The only instance I can think of where you have no choices is if a vehicle travelling in the opposite direction smashes through the central resevation suddenly and violently.
What about if you're overtaking something and it suddenly veers into your lane?
I'm in full agreement about leaving the necessary space (and more) - but at some point, you have to be closer to things, albeit things in a different lane. But you can't control matters if they suddenly ARE in your lane.
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I see free speech works!
And who is the first to complain of censorship of the pres? yep the journalist !
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I think that if you were driving at 75-80 mph on your speedo, (probably 72-76mph in reality); in lane 3, overtaking a lorry in lane 2 (so swerve to lane 2 not an option); on a long sweeping left hand bend (limited forward vision and blocked by lorry); on an unlit part of a m/way at night (e.g. M6 at the top end of it); rain (so wet carriageway).. and were confronted with a dark car with no lights showing, sideways in the carriagway having just had an accident...that you'd hit it fair and square...just like everyone else would
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Agreed. So that would be a good reason not to, quote "[drive] at 75-80 mph on your speedo, (probably 72-76mph in reality); in lane 3, overtaking a lorry in lane 2 (so swerve to lane 2 not an option); on a long sweeping left hand bend (limited forward vision and blocked by lorry); on an unlit part of a m/way at night (e.g. M6 at the top end of it); rain (so wet carriageway).. "
You don't need to be a sanctimonious mimser to back off in these circumstances, just to have enough imagination.
It's the same with the wall of spray at the side of an LGV - 9999/10000 times you could drive through it and come out the other side OK, and most people do exactly that; but one of the great things about growing up is that you don't have to do what everyone else does.
Edited by Manatee on 19/10/2008 at 19:46
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You don't need to be a sanctimonious mimser to back off in these circumstances just to have enough imagination.
agreed...last year drove from London to Scotland overnight, thinking I could 'press on' with much lighter traffic and much less chance of a camera van sat on the bridge on the M6
the cunning plan was foiled by thick fog from the M25 to M6 at Rugby (via M40)... so sat doing the same speed as the heavies
absolutely frightening the speed some people were coming past at. Not being judgemental about the speed in general, as sometimes i do it...just the fact you couldn't see anything..it was like driving into a wall...some people must have a death wish
'time and place' comes to mind
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the cunning plan was foiled by thick fog from the M25 to M6 at Rugby (via M40)... so sat doing the same speed as the heavies absolutely frightening the speed some people were coming past at. Not being judgemental about the speed in general as sometimes i do it...just the fact you couldn't see anything..it was like driving into a wall...some people must have a death wish
Fog - Recall going round the M25 early early one sunday morning, down to about 30mph at times, with the guys with radar in their cars passing me at 70...
Frightening stuff indeed!
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That is one nightmare scenario Wp. But there are others on motorways too. I have gone on before about the slipstreaming trains tailgating each other at 130 mph in the rain on German motorways, the results of which when something goes badly wrong I have witnessed: a mile of steaming wreckage and embarrassed (if they're lucky) drivers.
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Don't misunderstand me by the way. I don't think 130 is too fast on a motorway. I just think at that speed two or three hundred yards is a safer gap in the rain than 20 feet or less. Even then you would have to be pretty alert.
I hope the Germans don't depress us by abolishing unlimited Autobahns.
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It was Metz in France today.Fog-26+vehicles.
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Time for a small tangent here? CRUISE CONTROL. I think the increasing popularity of CC will have consequences all too soon. Thinking of drivers who are already half asleep/on a permanent death wish / oblivious to every single other driver on the road..I use CC on my car when the motorway or A road is straight, dry and clear; the rest of the time it stays off. So many drivers I see use the brakes to switch it off (!!), or else steam right up the car in front to maintain momentum and the alleged fuel savings. (Yeah, right....) Final thought: is there no cut-off speed, above which it is impossible to use CC? I can't for the life of me think of the benefits of CC-maintained 90 mph!!
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With the simple "cruise control" controller on my Golf GTI 1.8T and Passat 1.8T I could read the road ahead and speed up and slow down using it and switch it off. All without looking at it. Then when I got the Mondeo after 4 years I'd still need to glance and the steering wheel to know where the controls were. I used it very little so never did learn to feel them in an instant - so it never improved in use.
The Mazda6 with cruise and again I can alter speed and turn off without looking - I think that's all ergonomics. So even on motorways it's possible to use it and read the road well ahead.
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it was fairly late in my driving life that i picked up you shouldn't use CC in heavy rain or worse, in case you hit standing water and the CC tries to automatically increase speed,
just at a time you really would rather it didn't
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Cruise control is like Sat nav - it can lead to drivers thinking that something else is doing the thinking for them and that is simply a bad thing.
What is wrong with using your right foot to control speed in line with the conditions around you? What is wrong with taking the responsibility for knowing where you're going?
I learnt to take responsibility for myself long before I took my test.
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I think CC was an American device intended to help drivers doze while travelling dead straight for 10+ miles across (e.g.) the Nevada desert. Many US roads also had fairly low speed limits, so it helped to prevent speed creeping up dangerously - witness the huge warning signs at (to us) almost undetectable bends.
It has precious few real benefits in the UK, IMHO, and several potential disadvantages.
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it was fairly late in my driving life that i picked up you shouldn't use CC in heavy rain or worse in case you hit standing water and the CC tries to automatically increase speed just at a time you really would rather it didn't
Curiously I had the CC on in my Seat Leon a few months ago and hit a patch of standing water. The CC deactivated itself. I'm not sure if that's by design or fluke though...
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Curiously I had the CC on in my Seat Leon a few months ago and hit a patch of standing water. The CC deactivated itself. I'm not sure if that's by design or fluke though...
I think you will find that these days the cruise control systems are intelligent enough to recognise adverse conditions, e.g. sudden spike in wheel speed due to aquaplaning, and deactivate themselves. They use the ABS sensors on the wheel hubs which can tell you all sorts of things about what the car is doing. I use my cruise control all the time and, to be honest, wouldn't want to buy a car without it. I thought about ordering the radar based system on my next company car but decided it was ridiculously expensive and stuck to the normal one.
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CC I have found good in areas with camera zones, A34 in the midlands springs to mind!
Slightly off a tangent, but what is it with cars that have come to a stand-still on motorway? I have seen numerous roll backs with drivers taking the foot off brake or not putting on hand-brake and allowing the car to roll back and hit the car behind them - always seems like slow motion (I expect a circus band music to play for some reason though nothing comedy about it)
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Honda came up with a system for the Legend of adaptive cruise control that not only keeps the car at a pre-set speed, but slows it down to the speed of something ahead, stops the car if that something ahead stops and also steers the car, keeping it exactly central to the white lines either side. However, because it can't anticipate something totally unexpected, the lawyers wouldn't allow the total hands free system to be fitted. The automatic steering cuts out after just a few seconds.
HJ
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