Car scrappage scheme Vol 1 (Read Only)

Honest John Back Room » Motoring discussion
View Threaded
Sat 7 Mar 2009 19:12
Car scrappage scheme Vol 1 (Read Only) - brg190 pete

***** This thread is now closed, please CLICK HERE to go to Volume 2 *****

Hi all

SWMBO needs a new car. Her current Micra is 11 years old and we feel it's time to change.

We've driven a few cars and she has decided she wants a Fiesta. She favours buying one of the last of the old shape cars but I would prefer her to buy a new shape Fiesta, as it is safer.

All set to do a deal (though local Ford garage don't seem particularly interested and we should be great customers - paying cash and no part-ex) - but then I say - hang on, is the Govt going to introduce a scrappage scheme and give us £2k trade-in on our old car? And, if they do, will the scheme work only against new cars or cars up to, say, a year old? And will we see any benefit - or will the dealers just increase the price of the new car?

I know the SMMT have been pushing this and that there are similar schemes in other countries, but what's the general feeling in the backroom as to whether this will be introduced? I guess if the March new car sales are really poor, it may be more likely.

Having this sort of scheme hanging around in the background is a bit silly because I would have thought other people would react in the same way I have and that the outcome is even fewer people buy new cars until we know whether the scheme will get the go-ahead?

Edited by Dynamic Dave on 30/04/2009 at 22:36

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 7 Mar 2009 19:31
car scrappage scheme - ole cruiser
I agree with all the sentiments in this post and with the questions. It's like the rumours of suspending stamp duty on house purchases, which immediately froze up the house market. Personally I would feel pretty miffed if, having virtually given away a good 20-year old car a while ago, I might have made 2,000 pounds by waiting a bit. Having said that, however, I cannot think it would really be a sensible scheme; but then they are just making it up as they go along. One thing I would put my money on is that if it is introduced it will only apply to brand new cars, to get the factories moving - there would quite obviously be no point in just moving existing stock around.
I think the consequences for - excuse me - the Rattle market would bear weighty consideration - all those perfectly good cars that would give someone pleasure and use for a good few years, and he wouldn't be able to get his hands on them.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 7 Mar 2009 19:33
car scrappage scheme - Stevieboy
I'm also waiting to see if I need to buy an almost scrapped car to trade in and get a big discount on a new car (making it cheaper than a 1 year delivery miles pre-regged car).
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 7 Mar 2009 19:37
car scrappage scheme - ole cruiser
Quite. So that will push up the prices of "almost scrapped cars", then? It's bonkers, really, isn't it?
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 7 Mar 2009 20:41
car scrappage scheme - colinh
....or there'll be a clause in the scheme that you will have had to own the car for x months/years before you qualify
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 7 Mar 2009 20:50
car scrappage scheme - The Melting Snowman
Yes it's bonkers but then that's what happens when you have politicians who don't know what to do next. The latest joke is quantitative easing.

Edited by The Melting Snowman on 07/03/2009 at 20:51

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 7 Mar 2009 23:06
car scrappage scheme - Andrew-T
It's interesting that when everyone is in a state of financial panic, the recent information that the energy used to build a car was about equal to driving 100K-miles in it suddenly becomes forgotten or irrelevant ...
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 8 Mar 2009 01:15
car scrappage scheme - Harleyman
It's interesting that when everyone is in a state of financial panic the recent information
that the energy used to build a car was about equal to driving 100K-miles in
it suddenly becomes forgotten or irrelevant ...


That's my argument too for using a 45-year-old truck which does 15 to the gallon!
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 8 Mar 2009 07:53
car scrappage scheme - Stevieboy
If there is a clause then folks will just get people that have those cars to buy the new one on their behalf.

Oh, and the Legal Owner is not the same as the person on the DVLA Cert!
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 8 Mar 2009 08:51
car scrappage scheme - DP
Scrapping any roadworthy, reliable car is so environmentally irresponsible it should be a criminal offence.

It's still a mystery to me why the green lobby supports, in the countries who have implemented it, what is probably the most environmentally damaging and wasteful policy to have been dreamed up in recent memory.

Cheers
DP

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 8 Mar 2009 09:40
car scrappage scheme - NARU
what is probably the most environmentally damaging and wasteful policy to have
been dreamed up in recent memory.


Closely followed by the raising of housing stamp duty (*) - I spent three years commuting 100 miles each way rather than relocate because it was much cheaper.

(*) No problem paying a capital gain of some sort on houses, but the way it currently works is a tax on mobility - if I stay put I pay no tax; if I move to where there is a job, I have to pay.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 8 Mar 2009 09:55
car scrappage scheme - Armitage Shanks {p}
I have just been to Cyprus where they pay 1500 Euros to anyone who scraps a taxed/MOT'd car of a certain age; about 15 years I think. I fancy this is more to encourage sales than out of any concern for the environment
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 8 Mar 2009 10:14
car scrappage scheme - Victorbox
I can see it will boost the car sales for a sick car industry but there is no green argument when more pollution is produced in making a new car than driving it over its lifetime.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 8 Mar 2009 10:11
Car scrappage scheme - merlin
Having this sort of scheme hanging around in the background is a bit silly because
I would have thought other people would react in the same way I have and
that the outcome is even fewer people buy new cars until we know whether the
scheme will get the go-ahead?


I'm thinking of buying a new car but will wait a few more months to see if the car scrappage scheme is introduced as I have a 9 year old car.

Assuming the government have conditions to limit the scrappage scheme to genuine owners of old cars, then I cannot see there will be many with the finances to jump from an old car to a brand new one based on saving ~£2k. It will actually be less than that given the old car will be worth something.

Maybe if this scheme does go ahead the government will allow people to buy a cheap car on ebay and then get the £2k trade in for scrapping. At least this way more new cars will be bought which is what the government and car companies want.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 8 Mar 2009 10:51
Car scrappage scheme - isisalar
Surely if there are going to be incentives to buy new cars they should be targeted at moving the thousands of new cars that are currently siting around unsold.
Lets get rid of the old stock before making any new.This would give the manufacturers some much needed income,and reduce all the Polar bear killing factory emissions.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 8 Mar 2009 10:42
Car scrappage scheme - Mr X
Unless we have a change of government, I fear that any scrapping scheme in this country will be operated on a compulsory basis. Bearing in mind the current credit crisis , this may be seen as a way of keeping the motor makers in business.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 8 Mar 2009 10:55
Car scrappage scheme - DP
Unless we have a change of government I fear that any scrapping scheme in this
country will be operated on a compulsory basis.


I suspect they'd be more inclined to allow older cars, but tax them to the eyeballs in such a way that people who own them are forced to pay unless prepared to give the cars away for nothing, and go into debt for something newer.

It's what they tried with the 2001> VED hikes before the proposals were watered down.

Cheers
DP
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 8 Mar 2009 11:14
Car scrappage scheme - Alby Back
When I am in charge, all cars which have suitable running gear will be subsidised to be transformed into Westfields instead of being scrapped.

Recycling criteria met

Mid-life blues criteria met

Domestic objections overcome by official sanction


Win, win, win.......

;-)
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 8 Mar 2009 11:18
Car scrappage scheme - frazerjp
The whole scheme wouldn't make buy a new car, I personally prefer the character of older cars & preserving the future classics alike.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 8 Mar 2009 11:25
Car scrappage scheme - sooty123
What owner that has just scrapped an old car, is going to be in the market for a new car. There will be a few that it will help, but most that scrap on old car will be looking for another cheap car.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 8 Mar 2009 12:05
Car scrappage scheme - mike hannon
Nice one Humph. ;-)
I heard somewhere last week that the 1000 euro scrapping allowance now available in France made a big difference to new car sales in January (if you can believe what you are told) but by February sales had slumped again.
In some parts of rural France the fields behind garages still have piles of wrecks taken back in PX the last time this strategy was tried, more than 15 years ago, and unwanted by the scrap trade.
In the best French tradition, my back garden now hides a 16-year-old car (which is still actually in good running order and rust-free) that is worth zilch but I kept because I toyed with the idea of buying a new Jazz and getting 1000 euros off. Sadly, the idea of buying virtually anything available today fills me with gloom, so there it stays. And, anyway, I could twist the dealer's arm for 1000 off any time. If I couldn't, that's their problem.
Meanwhile, my smart, comfortable, fast, economical, etc, etc, Prelude is now 11 years old and - according to the French government and the motor trade - only fit for the scrapyard.
If there was any honesty in the world people like me would be paid to protect natural resources by keeping their older cars on the road. Fat chance.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Mon 9 Mar 2009 08:35
Car scrappage scheme - Cliff Pope
Cue for a national car-swapping scheme. I have an old car I want to replace, but can't possibly afford a new on. You want a new car but your old car is not old enough to qualify. So I supply the car, and we split the £2000.
I might go into business doing up only-just MOT failures and selling them to people who want to trade them in for new cars. They would be scrapped anyway, but this way the maximum number of people would benefit from the £2,000 handouts.

And of course some cars are worth more for the parts than for the running car. So you can scrap it for £2000 and sell the parts as well.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Tue 10 Mar 2009 15:34
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - robroy
Am I the only person postponing sale of 'old banger'/purchasing new, while Government 'dithers' over proposed Motor Trader's scheme.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Tue 10 Mar 2009 15:53
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - Mapmaker
Probably. Most people do not trade in worthless cars for brand new ones. Most people who buy new cars swap their cars every 2-5 years, long before they are scrappable.

In fact, most people who buy new cars are lease companies... so it will make no difference to them.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Tue 10 Mar 2009 16:16
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - robroy
Probably. Most people do not trade in worthless cars for brand new ones.
Hi Mapmaker! - well, while its a bit of a bonus to be thought of as 'unique' and while what you say does make certain sense, it appears to be at variance with what has happened on the Continent, where thousands of 'old bangers' have been traded in against new vehicles, tempted by a £2,500 government cash-back!


I for my sins always buy new, [present car 1997 Peugeot 306 -D.Turbo] and run them into the ground, thus erradicating the dreaded depreciation factor of changing every 2or3 years.

I would be a bit gutted to dispose of my 306, only for such a scheme, as implemented on the continent, to be introduced by the Government !!!
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Tue 10 Mar 2009 16:17
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - oldnotbold
It's a fine example of style over substance.

Govt announces scrappage scheme and gushes about how hundreds of thousands of old polluting death-traps will be taken off the road, and replaced by cars so green they actually make the environment better by driving them.

In reality the target is missed by 50% or more, but that's brushed under the carpet by the millions of tons of carbon saved by the next new announcement - which I can confidently predict will have us all pedalling stationary bikes as we work, thus giving us health-benefits as well as generating electricity when the wind isn't blowing hard enough to turn all the windmills now being installed.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Tue 10 Mar 2009 16:32
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - zarqon
Robroy

I'm not so much hanging on as keeping an eye out for this proposed scheme - there's a possiblity I will need a new commuter in the next few weeks and if I do I will trade in the old dog car to take advantage.

I agree about not many people trading 10 year old cars for brand new but I think there will be quite a few people with a spare car that they will weigh in to relace a more regularly used car.

I think the German scheme applies to 2nd hand cars upto 1 year old - sounds like its another 11 month old Mondeo for me (watch those prices go).

MPZ
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Wed 11 Mar 2009 08:33
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - Cliff Pope
There is an obvious snag in the scheme's achieving its objective, and that is if there is a requirement for the scrapped car to have an MOT.
For many people the decision to replace their car is occasioned precisely because their old one has failed its MOT. But then it would be too late to qualify. The intention surely can't be to persuade people to have say £1000 worth of repairs done solely so that the car can be scrapped?
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Wed 11 Mar 2009 08:46
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - Chris White
According to Daily Wail today, Ministers are backing the idea of a 'cash-for-scrap' bounty under plans to kickstart the motor industry.

Paul Everitt, chief executive of the Society of Motor Manufactures and Traders, which has been lobbying Ministers for help, said: 'The scheme would allow both cars and light commercial vehicles (vans) over nine years old to be scrapped in return for a £2,000 cash incentive towards a new or nearly new vehicle.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Wed 11 Mar 2009 09:26
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - Armitage Shanks {p}
Get the car tested in the month before the MOT is due, if it fails you have 30 days to get the dosh, based on your current/pass MOT - or would the compter spot that?
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Wed 11 Mar 2009 09:28
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - Mr X
I can't help thinking that this scheme will be compulsory. Once a vehicle reaches 9 years old, you will simply not be able to tax or mot it and there for not be able to use it on our roads.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Wed 11 Mar 2009 09:57
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - J500ANT
We too are holding out replacing the written off Signum until this scheme has been started or rumours killed off.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Wed 11 Mar 2009 10:22
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - Cliff Pope
We too are holding out replacing the written off Signum until this scheme has been
started or rumours killed off.


If it's written off is the MOT still valid? Can crashed cars qualify for the scheme?
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Wed 11 Mar 2009 10:40
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - robroy

If it's written off is the MOT still valid? Can crashed cars qualify for the
scheme?


Sorry to put a 'dampner' on your plans, but the Government scheme will be virtually identical to the Eco scheme presently operated by Vauxhall.

The criteria for which the 'cash-back' for scrapped will apply is as follows:-

The car proposed for scrapping will have to be owned[for an absolute minimum of 3 months] by the person purchasing the new car. The car will have to be in roadworthy condition, complete with a current MOT and be able to be driven to the dealer [roadworthy condition].

Dealer discounts will still be negociable with the dealer, as the cash-back for the scrapped car will be a separate 'deal' with the government, but administered by the dealer.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Wed 11 Mar 2009 12:17
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - robroy
Ooops! - omitted to say in the 'criteria' section, that cars must be over 9/10 years old.

Also, as far as I can determine, the whole aim of the proposed scheme is to tempt owners of cars already taxed/insured/MOT'd [and which comply with the required criteria] to scrap them for a 'government bounty' and purchase a new car.

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Wed 11 Mar 2009 12:01
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - J500ANT
>> We too are holding out replacing the written off Signum until this scheme has
been
>> started or rumours killed off.
>>
If it's written off is the MOT still valid? Can crashed cars qualify for the
scheme?

Actually I should have clarified, we have a Golf thats here waiting for no2 son to take/pass his test, its worth £500 max but we'd def let it go for £2k guv ;)

However, back to the reply, that Golf is a CatD after vandalism damage, wonder if that applies? In theory they're scrapping them so I dont see why not!
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Wed 11 Mar 2009 10:27
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - Chris White
I can't help thinking that this scheme will be compulsory. Once a vehicle reaches 9
years old you will simply not be able to tax or mot it and there
for not be able to use it on our roads.


I would not imagine that it will be compulsory, but I would think that eventually once vehicles get to a certain age that they would be taxed to such a point that it would them uneconomical to run.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Wed 11 Mar 2009 11:20
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - oldnotbold
"once vehicles get to a certain age that they would be taxed to such a point that it would them uneconomical to run. "

or subject to very arduous inspection/testing, as in Japan.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Wed 11 Mar 2009 11:38
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - mike hannon
AFAIK, the French scheme only stipulates that the car should be over a certain age and/or destined for the scrappy - presumably because it doesn't have a current sticker or has failed the two-yearly 'Controle Technique' test. I assume any car over the age limit that is turned in will have to be scrapped to comply with the scheme.
From this vantage point the UK looks as if it will manage (if it happens at all) to turn a simple process into a bureaucratic nightmare. Sigh.

Edited by mike hannon on 11/03/2009 at 11:39

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Wed 11 Mar 2009 12:13
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - theterranaut
Whats illuminating for me in this whole matter is how readily the government shove aside green issues for those of big business.

Sadly, it gives the lie to there being any real commitment to environmental issues. But happily, it now confirms that anyone who suspected that green issues are being used as a stealthy, feel-good tax was right all along.

tt
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Wed 11 Mar 2009 12:54
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - Roger Jones
Good grief: even the highly dubious George Monbiot thinks it's devious nonsense:

tinyurl.com/bkr9vz

Did I say devious? Peter Mandelson -- devious? Surely not . . . or perhaps maybe.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Wed 11 Mar 2009 13:00
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - Garethj
I think scrapping a perfectly usable vehicle is a great idea. What with all their inefficiencies, old cars should be binned and replaced with new ones, it'll help the motor industry too!

In fact, why stop there? Why not do the same with houses - all the old ones are draughty, lose heat like nobody's business their carbon footprint must be huge, and the house building sector also needs a kick start.

So, anyone in a house more than 10 years old should be taxed to leave it and made to part-ex it for a new one. And who wants all these old buildings around the place anyway? Destroy it all I say.

Does sarcasm come across in type? I wasn't sure....
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Wed 11 Mar 2009 17:19
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - quizman
Yes Gareth I get and agree with your message.
My Passat will be 9 years old next year, it is low mileage and in excellent condition. It has passed all it's MOTs first time, with no emmission problems. I still enjoy driving the car and it would be perfectly capable of going to Berlin and back.
Why should people pay tax so that this car can be scrapped? It's total nonsence, the lousy government have been trying to stop people driving for 11 years and now people are not buying it is in a panic.

All most of the old cars on the road need is a bit of Millers fuel treatment and a good run. That would clean the cobwebs out.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Wed 11 Mar 2009 17:30
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - CGNorwich
Whats illuminating for me in this whole matter is how readily the government shove aside green issues for those of big business.

Not as quickly as the Bank of England has shoved aside its commitment to keeping inflation in check and starting printing money by the cartload
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 12 Mar 2009 08:21
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - Pizza man
My Cordoba estate TDi i've just bought for £1800 is nine years old in september and nowhere near ready for the scrapyard, it's madness, oh and it'll do about 55mpg....so not too un-green certianly better then my arosa or lexus.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Wed 11 Mar 2009 20:07
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - boxsterboy
Am I the only person postponing sale of 'old banger'/purchasing new while Government 'dithers' over
proposed Motor Trader's scheme.


On the contrary, I am thinking of 'investing' in cheap old bangers and storing them (with just a valid MOT) until I need to buy new cars in the future!
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 12 Mar 2009 08:12
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - Cliff Pope
>> >> On the contrary I am thinking of 'investing' in cheap old bangers and storing them
(with just a valid MOT) until I need to buy new cars in the future!


That was my scheme. You don't need to buy new cars yourself - simply sell them to people who do. Scrapyards could run schemes where you "sponsor" one of their cars, 3 months in advance of buying new. You need never see or drive it, just pay the fee to the scrapyard and collect your £2500.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 12 Mar 2009 08:22
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - Woodspeed
This happened in Denmark some years ago, and a lot of old bangers were taken off the road, but their MOT rules were way below ours, and only every 2 years. Germany does it because of the amount of cars they make there. BMW, Mercedes, Open (Vauxhall) Ford. Luxury stuff down to every day models. What cars do we make here. Only luxury models - and I can't see those being subsidised. Range Rover, Jaguar, Bentley (well a few) Rolly Royce.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Fri 13 Mar 2009 10:57
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - Roger Jones
"What cars do we make here."

Toyota, Nissan, Honda, . . .
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Fri 13 Mar 2009 12:08
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - boxsterboy
and Minis and Transits.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 19 Mar 2009 18:31
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - robroy
Loo>> Am I the only person postponing sale of 'old banger'/purchasing new while Government 'dithers' over
proposed Motor Trader's scheme.


Looks like Gordon's lachie Alistair, following Mandy's reccommendations, will announce the implementation of the much awaited 'car scrappage scheme' at the April budget.

Qualifying criteria will be:-

1. Proposed car to be purchased, must be new or less than one year old.
2. Emissions of proposed car to be purchased must be less than that of car to be scrapped.
3. Car to be scrapped must be over 9 years old, complete with M.O.T. be capable
of being driven to dealer's forecourt and must have been registered, for a minimum period [yet to be determined], in the name of the purchaser.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Fri 20 Mar 2009 09:05
'Proposed' Government scrappage scheme. - commerdriver
2. Emissions of proposed car to be purchased must be less than that of car
to be scrapped.

If the car being scrapped is over 9 years old where do they get emissions figures for it?
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Fri 13 Mar 2009 23:29
Deal to trade in used cars - rtj70
The other broadsheet paper with a name starting with a T is saying there may be a scheme paying £2000 to scrap older cars and buy a new or up to one year old car after all...

Is this true I have no idea.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 14 Mar 2009 09:11
Deal to trade in used cars - Rhubarb
It's been reported in several places over the past couple of days that Ford have done their budget estimates for the coming year on the basis that there will be a scrappage scheme in the UK. Do they know something we don't?

Edited by Rhubarb on 14/03/2009 at 09:12

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 14 Mar 2009 11:19
Deal to trade in used cars - mike hannon
Presumably it was trailed when they took their begging bowl to the government.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 14 Mar 2009 13:12
Deal to trade in used cars - brg190 pete
Went to test drive a new Fiesta today. A nice solid car, I thought, but not cheap at £11k in the spec we want. It appears that Ford may well be anticipating the scrappage scheme as the salesman showed me a letter from Ford saying that all Fiestas will be increasing in price by at least £600 on 1 April.

Given a part-ex offer for our 11 year old Micra of only £400, we'll just have to wait until the budget in the hope of getting the £2k allowance. Shall be a bit annoyed if the scrappage scheme doesn't come in and I have to pay the higher price.

It certainly doesn't seem there are stockpiles of Fiestas. Whatever colour we want seems to be a factory order and they don't seem to hold demo models as they sell all they can get.

We'll be choosing between a Fiesta 1.25 Style + and a Hyundai i20 Classic for about £9k. I've read the CBC breakdowns but I would be grateful for any feedback from the backroom on real-world experience of either of these cars.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 14 Mar 2009 13:36
Deal to trade in used cars - Another John H
Today's Telegraph suggests the discounted car will have to be better than 130g emissions, to qualify for the deal.

We're in the queue for this offer too....

Edited by Another John H on 14/03/2009 at 13:38

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 14 Mar 2009 13:47
Deal to trade in used cars - t_c
I think it would be a scandal if the manufacturers were not made to match the government subsidy and not be allowed to raise prices. After all they can sell excess stock to Motorpoint etc at 5k below list.
e.g. new VW Jetta www.motorpoint.co.uk/(S(yiskxizu5ywzhfz4gpjczgj3))/Search/VehicleDetails.aspx?vehicle=221208
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 14 Mar 2009 14:09
Deal to trade in used cars - Rhubarb
Today's Telegraph suggests the discounted car will have to be better than 130g emissions to qualify for the

>>deal.

I would expect some limitation like this. :-(
We're in the queue for this offer too....


I think that anyone who wants a a car should go and buy now, I suspect that the scrappage scheme will start when the inevitable rise in UK car prices comes due to ever worsening exchange rates. Cars that are currently £15k in the UK are around 20k euros. Given that we are approaching pound euro parity this situation cannot continue for long.

Edited by Rhubarb on 14/03/2009 at 14:10

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Tue 17 Mar 2009 17:02
Scrappage Scheme - rickla13
Well - I am looking to replace my 10 year-old (and showing it) Peugeot 406 Estate with a nearly-new equivalent.

Each time I venture onto AutoTrader or to my local Car Supermarket, I get pretty close to taking the plunge, and then read something more about proposals to introduce some sort of "bung" to encourage people to trade in their dirty old cars in exchange for a new or nearly-new planet-friendly vehicle.

Now I would like to see the figures that show how long it takes for the environmental impact of building a new car to be offset by savings from emissions, and fuel efficiency, but for now I am more interested in my own pocket.

With £2k being talked about as the likely figure (?2.5k in Europe I believe at the moment - which is about £2.5k!) - this is quite an incentive for people in my boat to spend the £200 on q new clutch to try and extend the Peugeot's residence for a few more weeks/months.

Does anyone have any feelings about whether this scrappage scheme will come in, when it might be from, and whether it would cover nearly-new cars (no point for me if it does not, £2k would never be enough to subsidise that initial depreciation hit on a brand new car) as well as new ones?

Rick
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Tue 17 Mar 2009 18:30
Scrappage Scheme - gordonbennet
They can keep their (ours actually, as usual Nu Lab are throwing someone else's money like confetti) 2K, don't suppose i'm alone in not wanting a shiny new cloned car with zero individuality.

Wouldn't it be more environmentally responsible to give grants to keep old cars going as councils do or did when homeowners renovated older houses.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Fri 20 Mar 2009 10:30
Scrappage Scheme - mike hannon
Yes it would. But that would be responsible long-term thinking and, as such, politically unacceptable. And we don't want to put you out of a job, GB.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Fri 20 Mar 2009 19:55
Scrappage Scheme - gordonbennet
.
And we don't want to put you out of a job >> +


Ah, never gave that a thought...like turkeys voting for Christmas..

folds hands behind back and slopes off whistling quietly..;)
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 22 Mar 2009 12:26
Scrappage Scheme - Rattle
I have not been following this thread so apologises if this has been said else where, just didn't want to make a new thread but this why I am so against it:-

1) It means forigin companies will benefit
2) Even if it increases work load in UK factories does the ecomomic cost of such a scheme make this benefit worth while?
3) It will increase the value of older cars making it even harder for the poorer people in the UK to afford a car.
4) More car production means an increase in Co2 emisions something the UK government is trying to reduce.
5) If people are givien £2300 how are they going to find the rest of the money? This money will be taken out and it means consumers may spend less on other things.

I believe the money is much better spent in an investment in public transport, this is now seriously lacking in the UK and as motoring becomes and more expensive if we don't get faster train services and more local buses soon the UK will lag far behind some other countries. The UK government have allowed four transport companies to get very very rich who and they are basicialy making a fortune from the poorest in our society providing often a substandard service. Where I live there has been a lot of investment but it needs to be more widespread.

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 22 Mar 2009 12:54
Scrappage Scheme - oilrag
"I believe the money is much better spent in an investment in public transport"

Can`t get up to much fun on a bus though. From 16yrs onwards all the women we met assumed a set of wheels - even if the holes in the floor were covered with old carpet. ;-)
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 22 Mar 2009 19:40
Car scrappage scheme - gpmartin
We are probably in the rare position of having (a) a 10-year-old car and (b) a bit of spare capital that's earning peanut crumbs in the bank. For the kinds of reasons already mentioned in this thread, I think the proposed scheme is an idiotic waste of money that's quite clearly about propping up ailing manufacturers rather than saving the environment, and I'd be very happy if it didn't end up happening. In fact part of me is almost bloody minded enough to want to keep our (perfectly serviceable, 110k, 163g/km) car going even if a scheme did come in. But £2k is at least double any trade-in (or even private sale), as well as being less hassle, and new and nearly-new care prices are as low as they're ever likely to be.

So we had a little scout round the showrooms today to see what's available. Living near Derby, there are brand new (or perhaps pre-reg) Focuses etc. available with £5k+ off list at Motorpoint. But I'm hoping that the scheme includes year-old cars, as there seem to be some really good deals in this range - and the presence of the car supermarket helpfully seems to depress the prices of nearby dealers' stock, too. A young family means I'm in two minds about what size of car to go for, but when 58-plate, sub-10k Mondeo Zetec 2.0TDCIs are £12k and 09-plate Focus Style 1.6 petrols are only £2k cheaper, the decision seems easy. I'd better wait and see what the bar is in terms of the new car's emissions rating before I get too excited, though - if it's (say) 120g/km then that sort of limits the choice...

Edited by Webmaster on 22/03/2009 at 23:52

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 22 Mar 2009 19:48
Car scrappage scheme - Rattle
Oil rag its not really about fun. Britian is full and it means there is not really any room for any more cars. The general public have shown this by not buying them. I've mentioned this before but we need a massive increase in the use of mass transit systems and we must also encourage people to work closer to home, I am not sure how this would work.

I think part of the problem is cars made ten years ago were probably about as good as it will ever get, they had good safety, nice smooth engines but were not overly complicated like they are now. We have not really had much improvement. When you compare a 1989 small hatch a 1999 one there is a huge difference, compare a 1999 to a 2009 one not a lot seems to have changed.

I believe the car manfucatures will suddenly recover once fuel cells come onto the mass market.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Tue 24 Mar 2009 10:12
Car scrappage scheme - Lloydy 25
Apparently Mandy has approved the scheme and it will be announced in the next budget. My question is, if you had a car worth £1800, would you get the trade-in and the scrappage? And does the car have to be scrapped just because it is 9 years old? Those moaning about environmental issues should consider that cows produce more greenhouse gases than all the worlds cars and planes combined. That 99.9% of carbon comes from the seas being warmed by the sun. That after ww2 carbon emissions increased massively whilst global temperatures dropped. That the planet has gone through a natural heating / cooling cycle for millions of years.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Tue 24 Mar 2009 10:41
Car scrappage scheme - Mr X
Mr X's crystal ball says that the scheme will start off as voluntary but quickly become compulsory and be reduced to all cars 8 years and over. Those wishing to keep ' classic cars " or cars over 8 years old will be required to pay a ' special " yearly tax for the privilege which will be on some sort of inflation linked escalator.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Tue 24 Mar 2009 11:34
Car scrappage scheme - robroy
My question is if you had a car worth £1800 would you get the trade-in
and the scrappage?


NO, NO, NO! - it is a 'scappage' scheme for cars over 9 years old! - the car is/must be scrapped[crushed!] there is no trade-in value what-so-ever, only a scrappage fixed sum, which will be in the order of £2000. This sum will be allowed against the cost of the new/one year old car [less CO2 emissions than car being scrapped] and claimed by the dealer from the government, The buyer thus who is scrapping his car against a new/one year old car will ostensibly be able to negociate the cost of the new/one year old car, as if there is no trade-in involved.
Just by-the-by, I would of thought that the scheme would be intended for cars of under £1000 in value, - over £1000 in value and the benefit of such a scheme, would be much diminished.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Tue 24 Mar 2009 13:52
Car scrappage scheme - greenhey
The logic here is terrific.
Because there are other, more significant, sources of greenhouse gasses, what's the point in trying to reduce those emitted by vehicles?
The same logic- murder as a cause of death is a tiny, tiny fraction of the deaths worldwide. Disease, organ failure, starvation, malnutrition, etc, cause many more deaths.So why bother trying to prevent murders?
SQ

Edited by Dynamic Dave on 24/03/2009 at 19:13

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Tue 24 Mar 2009 15:24
Car scrappage scheme - Lloydy 25
" The logic here is terrific.
Because there are other more significant sources of greenhouse gasses what's the point in trying
to reduce those emitted by vehicles?
The same logic- murder as a cause of death is a tiny tiny fraction of
the deaths worldwide. Disease organ failure starvation malnutrition etc cause many more deaths.So why bother
trying to prevent murders?" That is ridiculous and you know it. Saying that cars are responsible for a very very very tiny percentage of polution is not the same as saying murder is rare so lets allow it.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Tue 24 Mar 2009 15:34
Car scrappage scheme - Lloydy 25
And in further reply to "greenheys" cars / murder comparison, saying we should allow murder because it causes few deaths would be ridiculous. But what if the government and media were constantly claiming that we are all murdering each other too much and soon we'll all be dead as a result. And we must be taxed to high heaven for murder whilst ignoring disease famine and natural disaster. Now THAT would be ridiculous. But it's exactly what we are living through with the eco-mentalists at the moment.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Tue 24 Mar 2009 11:13
Car scrappage scheme - greenhey
The big difference between the UK and say Germany and France re this idea, is that the vast majority of cars bought here now are imported; or if not, built in the UK by foreign companies. In France or Germany the money injected by the allowance would boost the dealers and then Renault, PSA , BMW, VW, even Ford and GM with German plants.
So the govt would see quite a bit less effect for its money, in terms of keeping jobs going , than its major European counterparts.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Tue 24 Mar 2009 14:34
Car scrappage scheme - madf
We will NOT be trading in our 15 year old 106. It has another 10 years' life left.. as a minimum.

45-50mpg - used as a basic runaround..

We could replace it with an Aygo or 107 ... that's £6k ##and 60 mpg.. and for what real improvement? None...

If the Government had anything but for brains, they would have thought about this long ago but as they are basically anti-motorist and dumb, they wait until it's too late..to do anything for the Uk car industry.

The problem is: the Government has spent all OUR money, and our Children's money, and our Grandchildren's money....and achieved nothing but made a few MPs millionaires from expenses fiddles...


## which is 1200 gallons of diesel or another 60,000 miles travelling.

Edited by madf on 24/03/2009 at 14:35

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Tue 31 Mar 2009 19:09
Car scrappage scheme - Honestjohn
Here are some survival figures:-

The Banger Charts: Old Cars Still On UK Roads in March 2009

1980 cars registered 1,495,000, cars remaining 11,000

1981 cars registered 1,482,000, cars remaining 10,000

1982 cars registered 1,574,000, cars remaining 14,000

1983 cars registered 1,801,000, cars remaining 21,000

1984 cars registered 1,749,000, cars remaining 25,000

1985 cars registered 1,828,000, cars remaining 32,000

1986 cars registered 1,859,000, cars remaining 46,000

1987 cars registered 1,983,000, cars remaining 69,000

1988 cars registered 2,163,000, cars remaining 115,000

1989 cars registered 2,233,000, cars remaining 187,000

1990 cars registered 1,921,000, cars remaining 241,000

1991 cars registered 1,511,000, cars remaining 277,000

1992 cars registered 1,492,000, cars remaining 392,000

1993 cars registered 1,650,000, cars remaining 647,000

1994 cars registered 1,778,000, cars remaining 906,000

1995 cars registered 1,834,000, cars remaining 1,144,000

1996 cars registered 1,944,000, cars remaining 1,406,000

1997 cars registered 2,114,000, cars remaining 1,691,000

1998 cars registered 2,247,000, cars remaining 1,894,000

1999 cars registered 2,246,000, cars remaining 1,977,000

2000 cars registered 2,330,000, cars remaining 2,106,000

2001 cars registered 2,580,000, cars remaining 2,383,000

2002 cars registered 2,687,000, cars remaining 2,510,000

2003 cars registered 2,656,000, cars remaining 2,484,000

2004 cars registered 2,607,000, cars remaining 2,483,000

2005 cars registered 2,447,000, cars remaining 2,330,000

2006 cars registered 2,336,000, cars remaining 2,190,000

1980-2006 cars registered 54,545,000, cars remaining 27,592,000

HJ


Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Tue 31 Mar 2009 21:06
Car scrappage scheme - Dave^^
Thought it might be fun to add the percentages to this list:

Year. . . . . . . . . # cars reg . . . . . . # cars remaining . . . . . . . "% of cars remaining"
1980. . . . . . . . . . 1,495,000 . . . . . . . . . . 11,000 . . . . . . . . . . 0.7%
1981. . . . . . . . . . 1,482,000 . . . . . . . . . . 10,000 . . . . . . . . . . 0.7%
1982. . . . . . . . . . 1,574,000 . . . . . . . . . . 14,000 . . . . . . . . . . 0.9%
1983. . . . . . . . . . 1,801,000 . . . . . . . . . . 21,000 . . . . . . . . . . 1.2%
1984. . . . . . . . . . 1,749,000 . . . . . . . . . . 25,000 . . . . . . . . . . 1.4%
1985. . . . . . . . . . 1,828,000 . . . . . . . . . . 32,000 . . . . . . . . . . 1.8%
1986. . . . . . . . . . 1,859,000 . . . . . . . . . . 46,000 . . . . . . . . . . 2.5%
1987. . . . . . . . . . 1,983,000 . . . . . . . . . . 69,000 . . . . . . . . . . 3.5%
1988. . . . . . . . . . 2,163,000 . . . . . . . . . . 115,000 . . . . . . . . . . 5.3%
1989. . . . . . . . . . 2,233,000 . . . . . . . . . . 187,000 . . . . . . . . . . 8.4%
1990. . . . . . . . . . 1,921,000 . . . . . . . . . . 241,000 . . . . . . . . . . 12.5%
1991. . . . . . . . . . 1,511,000 . . . . . . . . . . 277,000 . . . . . . . . . . 18.3%
1992. . . . . . . . . . 1,492,000 . . . . . . . . . . 392,000 . . . . . . . . . . 26.3%
1993. . . . . . . . . . 1,650,000 . . . . . . . . . . 647,000 . . . . . . . . . . 39.2%
1994. . . . . . . . . . 1,778,000 . . . . . . . . . . 906,000 . . . . . . . . . . 51.0%
1995. . . . . . . . . . 1,834,000 . . . . . . . . . . 1,144,000 . . . . . . . . 62.4%
1996. . . . . . . . . . 1,944,000 . . . . . . . . . . 1,406,000 . . . . . . . . 72.3%
1997. . . . . . . . . . 2,114,000 . . . . . . . . . . 1,691,000 . . . . . . . . 80.0%
1998. . . . . . . . . . 2,247,000 . . . . . . . . . . 1,894,000 . . . . . . . . 84.3%
1999. . . . . . . . . . 2,246,000 . . . . . . . . . . 1,977,000 . . . . . . . . 88.0%
2000. . . . . . . . . . 2,330,000 . . . . . . . . . . 2,106,000 . . . . . . . . 90.4%
2001. . . . . . . . . . 2,580,000 . . . . . . . . . . 2,383,000 . . . . . . . . 92.4%
2002. . . . . . . . . . 2,687,000 . . . . . . . . . . 2,510,000 . . . . . . . . 93.4%
2003. . . . . . . . . . 2,656,000 . . . . . . . . . . 2,484,000 . . . . . . . . 93.5%
2004. . . . . . . . . . 2,607,000 . . . . . . . . . . 2,483,000 . . . . . . . . 95.2%
2005. . . . . . . . . . 2,447,000 . . . . . . . . . . 2,330,000 . . . . . . . . 95.2%
2006. . . . . . . . . . 2,336,000 . . . . . . . . . . 2,190,000 . . . . . . . . 93.8%
1980-2006. . . . . 54,545,000 . .. . . . . . . . 27,592,000 . . . . . . . 50.6%
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 12 Apr 2009 18:33
Car scrappage scheme - henry k
BBC reports "UK moves towards car scrap scheme"

news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7995928.stm
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 12 Apr 2009 18:40
Car scrappage scheme - zookeeper
if i get 2000 pounds for my deawoo i will not only have made 400% profit but the compensation i have been offered will cover my initial layout.....happy days!!!
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 12 Apr 2009 18:41
Car scrappage scheme - pmh2
>>Thought it might be fun to add the percentages to this list:<<


So what theories do we have for 2006? All the Poles returning home with their newly purchased vehicles now the credit crunch has bitten harder?


p
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 12 Apr 2009 18:46
Car scrappage scheme - bell boy
what a load of baloney the scrappage scheme is
does anybody really believe that a govt initiative to move motors via a credit for a car scheme will really do any good for consumers or manufacturers in the bigger scheme of lets say 5 years hence
to put it in laymans terms i sold a 51 plate car last week and the govt class it as scrap because its over 8 years old
pathetic
plus im out of a job if no one buys my bangers because i cant source then as they are on the good ship china
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 12 Apr 2009 20:43
Car scrappage scheme - Mr X
I'll say it again. Be careful what you wish for. This govt will have no hesitation in making the scheme compulsory in a few years time and we know what that means - extra taxes ( under the save the planet banner ) to be paid if you want to keep your 9 years old plus vehicle as a classic instead of scraping it.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 12 Apr 2009 21:05
Car scrappage scheme - stunorthants26
I doubt it would become compulsary since most people who own cars over 9 years old cant afford a better car so nor can they afford extra taxes to force them to upgrade.

As such, people stop using cars as they become the preserve of those who can afford to keep them up to date and they loose jobs as our economy is based on easy movement via the car for work. It just wont happen if they wish to keep the economy going.

It is a very stupid idea on the whole as my Daihatsu will in September be only 3 years from scrapping yet can still mix it emissions-wise with the vast majority of brand new small cars, so in 6 years there has been virtually no improvement in the small car sector regarding CO2.
There is no enviromental basis for it whatsoever ( other than using more energy to the detriment of it ), nor does it benefit our economy everytime they pay out since not that many cars are made here - if they made the payout exclusively for cars made in the UK, there would be a point.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 12 Apr 2009 21:16
Car scrappage scheme - Mr X
'most people who own cars over 9 years old cant afford a better car so nor can they afford extra taxes to force them to upgrade.'
I think thats one of the intentions, to get people out of old cars that they can barely afford and thus ensure our roads only contain the more environmentally friendly , newer vehicles.

As for ' easy movement ', I personally believe that it is the governments aim is to limit our movement in the future. Car ownership and use will be for those who meet stricter and stricter govt rules.

'if they made the payout exclusively for cars made in the UK, there would be a point.'
Piece in one of todays papers pointed out that any such scrapage scheme in the UK will mainly boost the car makers of Germany and France as us Brits on keen to buy vehicles made in the UK.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 12 Apr 2009 21:38
Car scrappage scheme - Waino
I doubt it would become compulsary since most people who own cars over 9 years

old cant afford a better car so nor can they afford extra taxes to force them to upgrade.>>

I can't believe that I'm exceptional in running a 12-year old Mondeo whilst, at the same time, keeping a couple of Bentleys in the bank - ostensibly (and possibly stupidly) to fund my retirement.

Anyway, I'm sure that the money I hand over to my local mechanic benefits the UK far more than if I bought a new Beemer from Germany
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 12 Apr 2009 21:46
Car scrappage scheme - stunorthants26
Im quite happy to buy my jap cars because while the car may not be built here, it was sold by a family owned local dealer and serviced by the village garage and supplying dealer between them.

Im not really interested in supporting british workers making cars for foreign owned companies, but I do wholeheartedly seek to support local businesses.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 12 Apr 2009 22:05
Car scrappage scheme - GeordieGuy
This scheme only seems to make sense if I can source the cheapest possible vehicle in order not to be hit by punishing depreciation. I'm happily running a diesel Pug 1996 405 so would benefit from such a mad-cap idea. It would pain me greatly to see an otherwise perfectly good vehicle go to the crusher. However, given that a Picanto can be bought new for £5600, then the likely cost to me of £3600 after subsidy starts to sound tempting. I know nothing of the Picanto, but any anecdotal advice would be welcomed.

Edited by Honestjohn on 13/04/2009 at 09:35

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 12 Apr 2009 22:17
Car scrappage scheme - stunorthants26
Id try for the base model Fiat Panda, esp now its had the 'eco' treatment. More spacious than the Picanto. Can get a Panda pretty cheap.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 12 Apr 2009 23:10
Car scrappage scheme - GeordieGuy
Thanks .... not many Pandas about, so have assumed that they're not highly rated - except by that sensible chap on Top Gear. Will look into.
I have no interest at all in badge snobbery ... just something that won't cost me much.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 12 Apr 2009 23:18
Car scrappage scheme - doctorchris
I just don't see this scheme getting off the ground.
The article, previously mentioned, from today's Sunday Telegraph, made it quite clear that government do not want a scheme that subsidises imported cars ( 90% of vehicle sales, I seem to recall).
GeordieGuy, Pandas are tough, reliable and well-engineered little cars with low running costs. Bought new at a discount they are great value but keep an eye on Autotrader and you will find some great used bargains.
For the best compromise between performance and running costs go for the Diesel.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 23 Apr 2009 10:12
Car scrappage scheme - Roly93
2006 cars registered 2 336 000 cars remaining 2 190 000
HJ

Crikey, what happened to the 146,000 cars missing since 2006, this is a fairly high rate of attrition !!
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 12 Apr 2009 23:29
Car scrappage scheme - brettmick
I have just taken delivery of a brand new Audi A3 (which is very nice but OT).

It replaced a 2005 Saab that went back to the finance company, but we also have a 1998 Mazda 323F. We plan to keep running this until the car needs too much money spent for its MOT.

HOWEVER, I will be very VERY upset if this scheme comes in without being backdated. I will be even more upset however if this scheme comes in at all. It is another desperate attempt from this desperate government to attempt to hang onto power and has nothing to do with green issues or protecting the motor industry.

What we need is people like me to keep their Saab for its useful life and not ditch it after three years because its value has collapsed and they fancy a change. Thing is, that is no good for jobs - even if it is the best thing for the environment and the persons (but not the industry/government) finances.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Mon 13 Apr 2009 06:41
Car scrappage scheme - loskie
The last couple of cars I've bought were around 5 yr old. I run them till 12yr 200000miles. Taking my expenses into account for work at HMRC standard mileage rate(40ppm) doing about 12000m business a year 20000 total my car runing costs to me are nil.
Nothing wrong with running an old car, kept well maintained and you also support your friendly independant mechanic (they will suffer with the scrappage scheme).
I probably will be tempted to part with my 10yr old 160000m Octavia for £2k(it cost me £4.5k , 5 years and 113000m ago) but only if I still get a good deal BEFORE I have the £2000 deducted. I'm not going to be conned into having it added on before negotiations start as I feel many might. I do also feel that people will buy on finance that they cannot afford to make use of this scheme thus compounding debt problems.

For a lot of good quality older cars it will be a "car wasteage scheme" NOT Scrappage scheme.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Mon 13 Apr 2009 19:05
Car scrappage scheme - Mr.Tee43
So, if I fancy a car for say £12000 and I turn up with 6 old bangers, do I get it for free ?
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Mon 13 Apr 2009 19:16
Car scrappage scheme - pony
So if I fancy a car for say £12000 and I turn up with 6
old bangers do I get it for free ?


take 7 and get cashback ? !!
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Mon 13 Apr 2009 20:08
Car scrappage scheme - quizman
I don't want to pay more tax so that people can buy more foreign cars.
The government have been trying to stop car use and have succeeded, so they panic and bribe folk to buy.
It would be better to lower taxes so people can spend more if they wish.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Mon 13 Apr 2009 20:18
Car scrappage scheme - captain chaos
The downside of lowering taxes would be less money for the government to throw at underdeveloped countries. Can't be having that now, can we? ;-)
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Mon 13 Apr 2009 23:36
Car scrappage scheme - bathtub tom
So my £50, '93 Kia Pride gets written off in an accident that's not my fault. It's got a current MOT, taxed and insured.

I claim I was about to scrap it for a new car.

What do I get?
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Mon 13 Apr 2009 23:41
Car scrappage scheme - bell boy
6 months for perjury
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Mon 13 Apr 2009 23:45
Car scrappage scheme - the swiss tony
So my £50 '93 Kia Pride gets written off in an accident that's not my
fault.
I claim I was about to scrap it for a new car.
What do I get?

Laughed at.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Mon 13 Apr 2009 23:59
Car scrappage scheme - Robin Reliant
He'd get a like for like replacement.



A shopping trolly.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Tue 14 Apr 2009 00:09
Car scrappage scheme - brum
1. The country can't afford to give away more billions - we are broke already!

2. It's a very ungreen initiative - completely stupid - Carbon footprint the size of South America. Pollutants from the scrap? I expect we'll ship that to a 3rd world country.

3. Only the rich will benefit.

4. I'm not aware of any "UK based" mass car manufacturer e.g. Vauxhall are US (GM) - Ford are US - Jag/Land Rover are Tata (India) etc etc

5. Most UK cars (by numbers) are imported e.g. No.1 chart topper Vauxhall Corsas are made in Spain/Germany No2 Ford fiesta made in Spain/Portugal/Germany

6. It distorts the market for new and used cars - many used car dealers will go bankrupt

7. The car industry will abuse the system and not restructure so when the system finishes manufacturers will just slump dramatically and many may go bankrupt

8. You have to scrap your car first and get a voucher, then go and buy a new car. Can you manage without a car for a while?

9. Is there sufficient scrap (recycling centre) capacity? You may have to wait several weeks to get your car scrapped.

10. When the dealers realise they have to wait a long time to get the money back off the Government, I bet they won't be so keen.

11. The retail sector will suffer badly retailers will go bankrupt - it is already happening in Germany.

12. Its just a bribe to con the public into thinking everything is hunky dory and Gordon is God.

13. Taxes will go up,up,up.......nothing in life is free!

Edited by brum on 14/04/2009 at 00:11

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Tue 14 Apr 2009 11:13
Car scrappage scheme - mattbod
I hope decent old cars will not be needlessly scrapped. Don't be conned by the green propaganda.why use up more resources when your 20 year old Nissan Micra is still going strong. This could also mean an end of cheap cars for new drivers as well as people ignorantly scrapping classics like a LS400 Lexus I know about.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Tue 14 Apr 2009 11:44
Car scrappage scheme - v8man
So when all these 'old' cars get scrapped the price of scondhand parts will go through the floor making it even cheaper to keep older cars on the road.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 18 Apr 2009 00:00
Car scrappage scheme - bell boy
news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/8003508.stm
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 18 Apr 2009 10:39
Car scrappage scheme - Roly93
And will we see any benefit - or will the dealers just increase the price of the new
car?

>>
Yes, I think the scheme will only work if the £2k is paid directly to the individual and not arranged via dealers. If it has to be added as 'discount' I can see most of this m,oney dissapearing into dealer accounts.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 18 Apr 2009 11:18
Car scrappage scheme - Harmattan
"... If it has to be added as 'discount' I can see most of this m,oney dissapearing into dealer accounts."

Something like this has happened in France according to a recent report in Autoplus magazine which went into various French dealerships with a car worth a little bit more than the 2500 euros on offer under the French scheme. Most of the dealers would not offer any discount or trade-in on the car and pointed instead to the scheme. Just one or two assessed it correctly and suggested selling privately. For this scheme and the electric car incentive, I would expect manufacturers to raise their list prices rapidly.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 18 Apr 2009 12:15
Car scrappage scheme - mike hannon
I think I'm right in saying that the allowance in France is 1,000 euros, not 2,500 as is the case in Germany. Some manufacturers seem to add their own allowance, though, as a sort of disguised discount.
Just to show that dealers are the same everywhere, I called this week at the Honda dealer in Limoges to look at a new Jazz. I know my name is on one somewhere but I still find the prospect depressing.
Anyway, the guy insisted on showing off his quite good English and told me he now had lots of English customers by word of mouth.
He gave me a brochure and a photocopied sheet with prices of each Jazz variant and the usual carp about having to pay extra for metallic paint, etc. The prices were not one cent off the official French list prices - which is, I guess, not really a surprise because the French regard a list price as laid down by law - and there was no mention of the scrappage scheme, or 'prime a la casse' (bribe for a scrapper!).
When I told him I had a 16-year-old Accord coupe that is due for scrapping (although it's in near-perfect condition, apart from ABS failure, if anybody wants it) and asked about the 'prime' he asked if it was RHD. I said yes it is, but it was registered in France years ago. He hummed and haa-d for a bit then said they might be able to do something but it wasn't really a French car. As if it was his money, the twerp. If a car is due for the scrapper what the hey does it matter which side the steering wheel is? Unless, of course, he has a friend in the trade who might want the car for other reasons...
I took the brochure and said 'au revoir'. Actually, word of mouth to me says they are useless and the best place to deal with is the Honda concessionaire in Poitiers, an hour away, who has had the dealership for more than 30 years.
As for the old Accord, I think I'd rather take it somewhere out the way and give it a Viking funeral (without trying to claim on the insurance!) than put up with anymore dealer knuckleheads.

Edited by mike hannon on 18/04/2009 at 12:16

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 18 Apr 2009 15:58
Car scrappage scheme - Harmattan
I think I deliberately managed not to say 'scrappage scheme' because it isn't entirely simple comparing complicated schemes in different countries. I have thrown the Autoplus article away but I believe it added in any bonus from manufacturers as well as the maximum eco-bonus available on certain low emission models which totals the incentive in some cases close to the German and proposed British levels. As for the superbonus? I haven't worked that one out completely. The general point is, however, that the manufacturers will be taking these consumer incentives into account in deciding their list prices in individual countries - much as they have always done. Incidentally, cdiscount.com are offering 6-8 per cent of the Jazz currently which probably stills leaves it well over the UK market price. Only 200 euros of eco-bonus too.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 18 Apr 2009 17:25
Car scrappage scheme - mike hannon
Thanks for the clarification - I guess you're right, it depends if you add in all the dealer incentive stuff, etc, to get to a final price. You're quite right - the manufacturers will price according to the consumer incentives and we buyers will go on being suckered.
Anyway, it ain't gonna happen to me until I am in a bath chair. I know buying a Jazz would be sensible, practical, ecologically sound, etc, etc, etc - which is why I won't actually do it until I'm close to being truthful when I say it'll be over my dead body. ;-)
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 18 Apr 2009 17:32
Car scrappage scheme - Lud
Will it really cost more to do the brakes in yr Accord than to change to a new Jazz mh? Surely the Accord is nicer, and may well live for ever if sensibly driven on the world's best rural A roads.

I can see why one might be hesitating to buy a lovely thirsty limo just at the moment. But a Jazz?
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 23 Apr 2009 10:04
Car scrappage scheme - Roly93
I think this is an utterly useless scheme and a waste of taxpayers money for the following reasons :-

1 It has to be done via a 'participating dealer' therefore the money will just get 'lost' in the price of the new car deal.

2 How many people who are running a 10+ year old car are in a position to buy a brand new replacement

I think this will benefit only a tiny number of people and will ultimately ONLY be of benefit to car dealerships and almost entirely non-UK car companies - whats the point !
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 23 Apr 2009 10:39
Car scrappage scheme - zarqon
I've got a 12 year old legacy estate - perfect for taking the dogs out into the country.

If I was to use this scheme I would have to spend a considerable amount of money to replace it with anything remotely comparable.

If there's a big expense discovered when the MOT comes round I'd be much more likely to replace it with a 5 year old equivalent for £5k and forgoe the government's "incentive".

With a bit of luck the scheme might make the 4/5 year car I'd be looking for a bit cheaper.

MPZ
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 23 Apr 2009 11:39
Car scrappage scheme - OldSock
One of the 'scrappage' provisos is that the vehicle must have a valid MoT certificate.

What proportion of cars currently being physically crushed go to their grave with a valid MoT? - excluding burnt-out and accident-damaged vehicles.

In fact, will a burnt-out wreck - having a 'valid' MoT still qualify :-)
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 23 Apr 2009 11:52
Car scrappage scheme - pmh2
>>In fact, will a burnt-out wreck - having a 'valid' MoT still qualify :-) <<


Where do you stop? A cube of crushed metal with valid MoT certificate and V5 delivered to the garage on collection of the new car





p
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 23 Apr 2009 13:24
Car scrappage scheme - bell boy
manufacturers interested in the scheme so far
already

Hyundai
Toyota
Ford however--Ford plans to use the scrappage discount for its larger cars only

Audi
Volvo
Peugeot
BMW



Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 23 Apr 2009 13:50
Car scrappage scheme - TheOilBurner
Ford however--Ford plans to use the scrappage discount for its larger cars only

Which should be interesting if the Govt puts a 150g/km limit on the deal...

Mondeo Econetic manages to slip under that, but with a list price of nearly £20k, I can't see many folks snapping them up.

Especially since a 12mth old nearly new example will probably be had for £12-£13k ((or less) soon...

Edited by TheOilBurner on 23/04/2009 at 13:54

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 23 Apr 2009 14:24
Car scrappage scheme - Rhubarb
Ford however--Ford plans to use the scrappage discount for its larger cars only


The SMMT are to meet with Government (Mandy) next week to sort out the detail. Apparently, one thing that is 'set in stone' is the requirement that manufacturers who sign up must offer the discount across the range.

See: tinyurl.com/c6s9ue
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 23 Apr 2009 14:41
Car scrappage scheme - bell boy
sorry,dont get my information from autocar ;-)
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 23 Apr 2009 14:51
Car scrappage scheme - Rhubarb
sorry dont get my information from autocar ;-)


That's why I said 'apparently'. :-)

Edited by Rhubarb on 23/04/2009 at 14:51

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 23 Apr 2009 17:11
Car scrappage scheme - madf
Great:
Announce a scheme..

And sort out the detail after.

Par for the course for a bunch of incompetents.


Reply | Report as offensive | Link